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Sounds good.<br>
<br>
No further comments from me :) <br>
<br>
<br>
Dimitris.<br>
<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 7/2/2018 5:45 μμ, Tim Hollebeek
wrote:<br>
</div>
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<div class="WordSection1">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:windowtext">Dimitris,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:windowtext"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:windowtext">We discussed
the bootstrapping problem on the governance call yesterday.
In the event that there is a need for a new WG and none of
the appropriate Certificate Consumers are currently members
of the Forum, the CAs that want that WG simply need to state
in the WG charter that one or more Certificate Consumers are
founding members of the WG. If the WG charter passes, then
the Founding Certificate Consumers become members of the
Forum due to their membership in the new WG. Therefore it
was the opinion of those on the call that the current Bylaws
can handle this situation adequately.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:windowtext"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:windowtext">-Tim<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><a name="_MailEndCompose"
moz-do-not-send="true"><span style="color:windowtext"><o:p> </o:p></span></a></p>
<span style="mso-bookmark:_MailEndCompose"></span>
<div style="border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0in
0in 0in 4.0pt">
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1
1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="color:windowtext">From:</span></b><span
style="color:windowtext"> Dimitris Zacharopoulos
[<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:jimmy@it.auth.gr">mailto:jimmy@it.auth.gr</a>] <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, February 7, 2018 12:05 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Virginia Fournier
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:vfournier@apple.com"><vfournier@apple.com></a>; Tim Hollebeek
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:tim.hollebeek@digicert.com"><tim.hollebeek@digicert.com></a>; CA/Browser Forum
Governance WG List <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:govreform@cabforum.org"><govreform@cabforum.org></a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> Dean Coclin
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:dean.coclin@digicert.com"><dean.coclin@digicert.com></a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [cabf_governance] Ballot 206 and
documents<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt">Hi Virginia,<br>
<br>
Ben circulated on Jan 23rd a revised Server Certificate WG
Charter that takes care of the WebTrust - ETSI alignment, so
we're good there.<br>
<br>
The Bylaws diff that takes care of the WebTrust - ETSI
alignment, is included in a word attachment I sent yesterday
(also correcting a wrong reference at the beginning of the
document). Please let me know if you need anything else.<br>
<br>
The only question is if the WG wants to further discuss the
"loop" problem. With the current language, you can't start a
WG without a "Certificate Consumer" <b>as a member</b>.<br>
<br>
<br>
Dimitris.<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">On 7/2/2018 12:00 πμ, Virginia Fournier
wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<p class="MsoNormal">Hi Tim and Dimitris, <o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Ok, it sounds like we have consensus
on what we need to have in the Bylaws and the Server
Certificate WG. Would you please send us an email
clearly indicating what needs to be changed? Please
note that redlines don’t come through in this format, so
maybe you could provide something like:<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">In Section 2.x, change “the red fox
ran fast” to “the red hen ran away.”<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Otherwise, a diff file would be
helpful as well. Thanks!<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Thanks very much! <o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"><br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">Best
regards,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">Virginia
Fournier<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">Senior
Standards Counsel<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Myriad
Set Pro",serif;color:#5E5E5E"></span><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"> Apple
Inc.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Segoe
UI Symbol",sans-serif">☏</span><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">
669-227-9595<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Segoe
UI Symbol",sans-serif">✉︎</span><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"> <a
href="mailto:vmf@apple.com"
moz-do-not-send="true">vmf@apple.com</a></span><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#4787FF"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">On Feb 6, 2018, at 11:51 AM, Tim
Hollebeek via Govreform <<a
href="mailto:govreform@cabforum.org"
moz-do-not-send="true">govreform@cabforum.org</a>>
wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span
style="color:windowtext">That sounds right to
me.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span
style="color:windowtext"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span
style="color:windowtext">-Tim</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span
style="color:windowtext"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div style="border:none;border-left:solid blue
1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt">
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid
windowtext 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in
0in;border-top-color:rgb(225,
225, 225)">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><b><span
style="color:windowtext">From:</span></b><span
class="apple-converted-space"><span
style="color:windowtext"> </span></span><span
style="color:windowtext">Dimitris
Zacharopoulos [<a
href="mailto:jimmy@it.auth.gr"
moz-do-not-send="true">mailto:jimmy@it.auth.gr</a>]<span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span><br>
<b>Sent:</b><span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span>Tuesday,
February 6, 2018 12:50 PM<br>
<b>To:</b><span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span>Tim
Hollebeek <<a
href="mailto:tim.hollebeek@digicert.com"
moz-do-not-send="true">tim.hollebeek@digicert.com</a>>;
CA/Browser Forum Governance WG List <<a
href="mailto:govreform@cabforum.org"
moz-do-not-send="true">govreform@cabforum.org</a>>;
Dean Coclin <<a
href="mailto:dean.coclin@digicert.com"
moz-do-not-send="true">dean.coclin@digicert.com</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b><span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span>Re:
[cabf_governance] Ballot 206 and documents</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white">Certainly
for the Server Working Group. But how about the
new general Bylaws or a new WG around S/MIME?
We've said numerous times that the Baseline
Requirements apply only to SSL/TLS Certificates
and so do the WebTrust for CAs Baseline + NetSec.<br>
<br>
I recommend adding both. 1 should apply to the new
Server Certificate WG and 2 should apply to the
new general Bylaws.<br>
<br>
Dimitris.<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white">On
6/2/2018 9:39 μμ, Tim Hollebeek wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span
style="color:windowtext">Ok, I think I get
it.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span
style="color:windowtext"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span
style="color:windowtext">We should either:</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span
style="color:windowtext"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<ol style="margin-top:0in" start="1" type="1">
<li class="MsoNormal"
style="color:windowtext;mso-list:l1 level1
lfo1;background:white">upgrade the WebTrust
requirement to “WebTrust for CAs Baseline and
NetSec” in order to align with requiring
411-1, or<o:p></o:p></li>
<li class="MsoNormal"
style="color:windowtext;mso-list:l1 level1
lfo1;background:white">downgrade the ETSI
requirement to 401 to align with requiring
“WebTrust for CAs”.<o:p></o:p></li>
</ol>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span
style="color:windowtext"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span
style="color:windowtext">Is that the right
summary?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span
style="color:windowtext"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span
style="color:windowtext">In this day and
age, I think (1) is the right approach.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span
style="color:windowtext"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span
style="color:windowtext">-Tim</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span
style="color:windowtext"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div style="border:none;border-left:solid blue
1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt">
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid
#E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><b><span
style="color:windowtext">From:</span></b><span
class="apple-converted-space"><span
style="color:windowtext"> </span></span><span
style="color:windowtext">Dimitris
Zacharopoulos [<a
href="mailto:jimmy@it.auth.gr"
moz-do-not-send="true"><span
style="color:purple">mailto:jimmy@it.auth.gr</span></a>]<span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span><br>
<b>Sent:</b><span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span>Tuesday,
February 6, 2018 12:25 PM<br>
<b>To:</b><span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span>Tim
Hollebeek<span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span><a
href="mailto:tim.hollebeek@digicert.com" moz-do-not-send="true"><span
style="color:purple"><tim.hollebeek@digicert.com></span></a>;
CA/Browser Forum Governance WG List<span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span><a
href="mailto:govreform@cabforum.org"
moz-do-not-send="true"><span
style="color:purple"><govreform@cabforum.org></span></a>;
Dean Coclin<span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span><a
href="mailto:dean.coclin@digicert.com" moz-do-not-send="true"><span
style="color:purple"><dean.coclin@digicert.com></span></a><br>
<b>Subject:</b><span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span>Re:
[cabf_governance] Ballot 206 and
documents</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white">On 6/2/2018 9:17
μμ, Tim Hollebeek wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><span
style="color:windowtext">For those of us
who have historically tried hard not to
understand European regulations, but
probably should understand them better
than we do, is one a superset of the
other, and if so, in which direction?
If not, what does the Venn diagram look
like?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><br>
ETSI EN 319 401 is the first level and 411
(part 1) is built on top of 401. Here is a
diagram available from the document ETSI TR
119 400 (<a
href="https://clicktime.symantec.com/a/1/2rg4jdXEPgpG0cVYXn_7B2jFMYhRbjZ1dDZ93zj7UIU=?d=Q-_kHzd0gf5QWQHtRHrPGfKdJo-f3eGryq7gLFMOP2nmmUSSN0U7d-mlnvjACjvkLYiE5YSQEMOLG71tO_RXchqmCncqIIcrFDtBeLZUAlZrHYS8NABgkLo9xeRneXrt67GFWsXpg4qrHaH2i1WE2nD-PJw6kFVRieKZGqfvwVIHbZc847hmNDYYX1OK-hZ2RJn83ueD16yLldoF5f-b26oVHL9YP3qAYqDB1DBj5oHF-Q438yRy8rGuXF2HtuTqmKwbBBcXk0PC1tLRGSErqip7OX_iU04gunrmBr-tIKOBZoFGECMHVRiWmRxQB1S5rVsr5AWiz9-5775yk-JIHODdvIp7ftjTJD56OOQ9yrXrU-QwbxLq6ktF8tL8RuOpgVEfSg%3D%3D&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.etsi.org%2Fdeliver%2Fetsi_tr%2F119400_119499%2F119400%2F01.01.01_60%2Ftr_119400v010101p.pdf"
moz-do-not-send="true"><span
style="color:purple">http://www.etsi.org/deliver/etsi_tr/119400_119499/119400/01.01.01_60/tr_119400v010101p.pdf</span></a>)<br>
<br>
<image001.png><br>
<br>
I hope it is clearer now.<br>
<br>
Dimitris.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><span
style="color:windowtext"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><span
style="color:windowtext">-Tim</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><span
style="color:windowtext"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div style="border:none;border-left:solid blue
1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt">
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid
#E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><b><span
style="color:windowtext">From:</span></b><span
class="apple-converted-space"><span
style="color:windowtext"> </span></span><span
style="color:windowtext">Govreform
[<a
href="mailto:govreform-bounces@cabforum.org"
moz-do-not-send="true"><span
style="color:purple">mailto:govreform-bounces@cabforum.org</span></a>]<span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span><b>On
Behalf Of<span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span></b>Dimitris
Zacharopoulos via Govreform<br>
<b>Sent:</b><span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span>Tuesday,
February 6, 2018 12:10 PM<br>
<b>To:</b><span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span>Dean
Coclin<span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span><a
href="mailto:dean.coclin@digicert.com" moz-do-not-send="true"><span
style="color:purple"><dean.coclin@digicert.com></span></a>;
CA/Browser Forum Governance WG
List<span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span><a
href="mailto:govreform@cabforum.org" moz-do-not-send="true"><span
style="color:purple"><govreform@cabforum.org></span></a><br>
<b>Subject:</b><span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span>Re:
[cabf_governance] Ballot 206 and
documents</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white">On 6/2/2018
9:02 μμ, Dean Coclin wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><span
style="color:windowtext">I’m still
confused. The requirements from
browsers is 411-1.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><br>
But the new Bylaws are not only for
Browsers :-)<br>
<br>
The Server Certificates WG will require
ETSI EN 319 411-1 BUT IT SHOULD ALSO
require not just WebTrust for CAs but
also WebTrust for CAs Baseline and
NetSec.<br>
<br>
Dimitris.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><span
style="color:windowtext"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid
#E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in
0in">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><b><span
style="color:windowtext">From:</span></b><span
class="apple-converted-space"><span
style="color:windowtext"> </span></span><span
style="color:windowtext">Dimitris
Zacharopoulos [<a
href="mailto:jimmy@it.auth.gr"
moz-do-not-send="true"><span
style="color:purple">mailto:jimmy@it.auth.gr</span></a>]<span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span><br>
<b>Sent:</b><span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span>Tuesday,
February 6, 2018 2:01 PM<br>
<b>To:</b><span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span>Dean
Coclin<span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span><a
href="mailto:dean.coclin@digicert.com" moz-do-not-send="true"><span
style="color:purple"><dean.coclin@digicert.com></span></a>;
CA/Browser Forum Governance WG
List<span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span><a
href="mailto:govreform@cabforum.org" moz-do-not-send="true"><span
style="color:purple"><govreform@cabforum.org></span></a><br>
<b>Subject:</b><span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span>Re:
[cabf_governance] Ballot 206 and
documents</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white">On 6/2/2018
8:15 μμ, Dean Coclin wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><span
style="color:windowtext">Dimitris,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><span
style="color:windowtext">We
currently list ETSI 411-1. Why
should we change to 401?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><br>
411-1 covers Baseline Requirements and
Network Security Requirements, which
is equal to WebTrust for CAs Baseline
and NetSec.<br>
401 covers similar items as WebTrust
for CAs.<br>
<br>
Dimitris.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><span
style="color:windowtext"><br>
Dean</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><span
style="color:windowtext"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<div
style="border:none;border-top:solid
#E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in
0in">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><b><span
style="color:windowtext">From:</span></b><span
class="apple-converted-space"><span
style="color:windowtext"> </span></span><span
style="color:windowtext">Govreform
[<a
href="mailto:govreform-bounces@cabforum.org"
moz-do-not-send="true"><span
style="color:purple">mailto:govreform-bounces@cabforum.org</span></a>]<span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span><b>On Behalf Of<span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span></b>Dimitris
Zacharopoulos via Govreform<br>
<b>Sent:</b><span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span>Tuesday,
February 6, 2018 12:16 PM<br>
<b>To:</b><span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span>Virginia
Fournier<span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span><a
href="mailto:vfournier@apple.com" moz-do-not-send="true"><span
style="color:purple"><vfournier@apple.com></span></a><br>
<b>Cc:</b><span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span>CA/Browser
Forum Governance WG List<span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span><a
href="mailto:govreform@cabforum.org"
moz-do-not-send="true"><span
style="color:purple"><govreform@cabforum.org></span></a><br>
<b>Subject:</b><span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span>Re:
[cabf_governance] Ballot 206
and documents</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white">On
6/2/2018 6:25 μμ, Virginia
Fournier wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white">Hi
Dimitris,<span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white">Would
you please let us know what
changes you’d propose to resolve
the issues you’ve mentioned
below? Your changes weren’t
left out intentionally - we
probably just missed your
request. Thanks.<span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><br>
Certainly. I have attached a
red-lined version of the proposed
changes on the
"CABF-Bylaws-v.1.8_23-Jan-2018.doc"
file, to align the ETSI audit
criteria with WebTrust. I also made
a small reference correction to the
"Certificate Consumer" definition.<span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span><br>
<br>
However, I couldn't provide an easy
language fix for the requirement 2.1
a, and I hope the WG will be able to
discuss on a future call. I will try
to highlight the problem and propose
some language to resolve the loop.<br>
<br>
Here are the current definitions:<br>
<br>
<u><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">(1)
"Certificate Issuer</span></u><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">: The member
organization operates a
certification authority that has a
current and successful WebTrust
for CAs audit or ETSI EN 319 401
audit report prepared by a
properly-qualified auditor, is a
member of a Working Group, and
that actively issues certificates
to end entities, such certificates
being treated as valid by a
Certificate Consumer Member.
Applicants that are not actively
issuing certificates but otherwise
meet membership criteria may be
granted Associate Member status
under Bylaw Sec. 3.1 for a period
of time to be designated by the
Forum"</span><span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span><br>
<br>
<u><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">(2)<span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span></span></u>"<u><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">Root Certificate Issuer</span></u><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">: The member
organization operates a
certification authority that has a
current and successful WebTrust
for CAs</span><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"
lang="EN">,</span><span
class="apple-converted-space"><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"> </span></span><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">or
ETSI EN 319 401 audit report
prepared by a properly-qualified
auditor, is a member of a Working
Group, and that issues
certificates to subordinate CAs
that, in turn, actively issue
certificates to end entities such
certificates being treated as
valid by a Certificate Consumer
Member</span><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"
lang="EN">.</span><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">
Applicants that are not actively
issuing certificates but otherwise
meet membership criteria may be
granted Associate Member status
under Bylaw Sec. 3.1 for a period
of time to be designated by the
Forum. "</span><span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span><br>
<br>
<u><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">(3)<span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span></span></u>"<u><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">Certificate Consumer</span></u><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">: The member
organization produces a software
product, such as a browser,
intended for use by the general
public for relying upon
certificates and is a member of a
Working Group"</span><span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span><br>
<br>
First of all, since 2.1 talks about
"qualifying for Forum Membership",
which I understand to mean
"Applicants", I propose we replace
"member organization" to "applicant
organization". In order to resolve
the loop problem, perhaps the part
of the "Certificate Consumer"
definition that talks about software
intended for use by the general
public for relying upon
certificates, should be included in
the definitions of (1) and (2).<span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span><br>
<br>
Here is a suggestion for these
definitions:<br>
<br>
<u><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">(1)
"Certificate Issuer</span></u><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">: The applicant
organization operates a
certification authority that has a
current and successful WebTrust
for CAs audit or ETSI EN 319 401
audit report prepared by a
properly-qualified auditor, is a
member of a Working Group, and
that actively issues certificates
to end entities, such certificates
being treated as valid by a
software product, such as a
browser, intended for use by the
general public for relying upon
certificates. Applicants that are
not actively issuing certificates
but otherwise meet membership
criteria may be granted Associate
Member status under Bylaw Sec. 3.1
for a period of time to be
designated by the Forum"</span><br>
<br>
<u><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">(2)<span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span></span></u>"<u><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">Root Certificate Issuer</span></u><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">: The applicant
organization operates a
certification authority that has a
current and successful WebTrust
for CAs</span><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"
lang="EN">,</span><span
class="apple-converted-space"><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"> </span></span><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">or
ETSI EN 319 401 audit report
prepared by a properly-qualified
auditor, is a member of a Working
Group, and that issues
certificates to subordinate CAs
that, in turn, actively issue
certificates to end entities such
certificates being treated as
valid by a software product, such
as a browser, intended for use by
the general public for relying
upon certificates</span><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"
lang="EN">.</span><span
class="apple-converted-space"><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"> </span></span><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">Applicants
that are not actively issuing
certificates but otherwise meet
membership criteria may be granted
Associate Member status under
Bylaw Sec. 3.1 for a period of
time to be designated by the
Forum. "</span><br>
<br>
<u><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">(3)<span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span></span></u>"<u><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">Certificate Consumer</span></u><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">: The applicant
organization produces a software
product, such as a browser,
intended for use by the general
public for relying upon
certificates and is a member of a
Working Group"</span><br>
<br>
<br>
Thank you,<br>
Dimitris.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white">Virginia
Fournier<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white">Sent
from my iPhone<span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white">Please
excuse iTypos<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white"><br>
On Feb 6, 2018, at 12:14 AM,
Dimitris Zacharopoulos <<a
href="mailto:jimmy@it.auth.gr"
moz-do-not-send="true"><span
style="color:purple">jimmy@it.auth.gr</span></a>>
wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white"><br>
Hello all,<br>
<br>
I reviewed the diffs and the
proposed alignment between
WebTrust and ETSI is not
included in the proposed
Bylaws draft (2.1a). I sent
a proposal on Jan 9th (<a
href="https://clicktime.symantec.com/a/1/xRJEOuXg-y_jlF4bPlvzPYNhn8a6eit8kncIq_wfMZ8=?d=zYU90j46QxTFNxAvlm_vJ4ZGqsTgwmt8yY9zvr0ptokxsxcxPTiHyfv81qHB08VOX3rrzZExOGgmgJkxIPZh2VDCB2-WrHv3HSXYZ8Wzk09rw2zFsyEvlFL13nhb7UzygerGhghF5qQl0uKJbkrgfHeL3_MxqGdnvlA7v_LK1cQLQhJS5vIh8quuXAU7PSSJvzKot7DAJo6bZDIRpzkFwNY2W9QBa2ODpEWTq9Pgug2qPyiezauI14B6fZZzXDwU0Ivj6KGS2Dy_1JXgXrsoUU_njc0WcH8N60MzLhzfYru_KK1QzFyolSRuA_TbFD0QG9P-7dp5mSt1H1BWsQ8OFAuLGgGHPbw9v12-oYSxeZkcV1l_eqlq15pTQI-hUSzH_gt5129IW5k-Txy56XOL79S-5w%3D%3D&u=https%3A%2F%2Fcabforum.org%2Fpipermail%2Fgovreform%2F2018-January%2F000355.html"
moz-do-not-send="true"><span
style="color:purple">https://cabforum.org/pipermail/govreform/2018-January/000355.html</span></a>)
about the Server Certificate
Working Group Charter but
the concept is the same for
the Bylaws.<o:p></o:p></p>
<ul style="margin-top:0in"
type="disc">
<li class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-list:l0 level1
lfo2;background:white">If
we include the requirement
for "WebTrust for CAs"
audit, then the equivalent
ETSI audit should be "<b>ETSI
EN 319 401</b>". This
probably fits best for the
Bylaws.<o:p></o:p></li>
<li class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-list:l0 level1
lfo2;background:white">If
we include the requirement
for "WebTrust for CAs +
WebTrust Baseline + NetSec
" audit, then the
equivalent ETSI audit
should be "ETSI EN 319
411-1". This probably fits
best for the Server
Certificate Working Group
Charter.<o:p></o:p></li>
</ul>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white">The
old ETSI TS standards
should not be included in
the new bylaws.<br>
<br>
I was also puzzled with
the following requirement
in the Bylaws (section
2.1a) "such certificates
being treated as valid by
a Certificate Consumer<span
class="apple-converted-space"><b> </b></span><b>Member</b>". So, if a CA
issues Certificates for
Digital Signatures which
are trusted by Adobe and
Adobe is not a Member of
the Forum, then this CA
doesn't meet the
requirements. Is this a
correct interpretation?<br>
<br>
<br>
Best regards,<br>
Dimitris.<br>
<br>
<br>
On 6/2/2018 9:15 πμ,
Virginia Fournier via
Govreform wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">Hi
all,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white">My apologies, I have a conflict for tomorrow’s
meeting and will
not be able to
attend. I am
sending what I
hope are virtually
final versions of
the documents. I
am sending diff
files for the
Bylaws and IPR
policy, as the
Word compare
function will not
cooperate. The
diffs may be
easier to read in
the end anyway.<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white">As you may have seen from my email earlier
today, we have to
cut off any new
issues, content,
etc. from being
added to the
ballot so we can
finalize it. From
this point
forward, we need
to just review
what we have,
clean up typos or
any errors in the
ballot, and move
it forward. With
this in mind, I’d
appreciate it if
you’d review the
documents
attached/referenced
below to see if
there are any
corrections/adjustments
that need to be
made. We can keep
a list of
additional
issues that should
be addressed for
the next ballot.<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white">What is the status of the Server Certificate WG
charter? I sent
some comments to
Dean/Ben - have
you had
a chance to look
at those? We
need the final
version of that
document also to
complete the
package.<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white">I’d like to send the documents out early next
week and start
an “informal” discussion
period of 7 days
next for any
questions people
may have. Does
anyone see any
obstacles to doing
that?<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white">Here’s the diff for the Bylaws (all changes
since version 1.7
shown).<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><a
href="https://clicktime.symantec.com/a/1/uyKpIpWVOanrzEuutNyKQlSALyoi3PkQHMormrBAvWs=?d=zYU90j46QxTFNxAvlm_vJ4ZGqsTgwmt8yY9zvr0ptokxsxcxPTiHyfv81qHB08VOX3rrzZExOGgmgJkxIPZh2VDCB2-WrHv3HSXYZ8Wzk09rw2zFsyEvlFL13nhb7UzygerGhghF5qQl0uKJbkrgfHeL3_MxqGdnvlA7v_LK1cQLQhJS5vIh8quuXAU7PSSJvzKot7DAJo6bZDIRpzkFwNY2W9QBa2ODpEWTq9Pgug2qPyiezauI14B6fZZzXDwU0Ivj6KGS2Dy_1JXgXrsoUU_njc0WcH8N60MzLhzfYru_KK1QzFyolSRuA_TbFD0QG9P-7dp5mSt1H1BWsQ8OFAuLGgGHPbw9v12-oYSxeZkcV1l_eqlq15pTQI-hUSzH_gt5129IW5k-Txy56XOL79S-5w%3D%3D&u=https%3A%2F%2Fdraftable.com%2Fcompare%2FJHYFfXWaHGRx"
moz-do-not-send="true"><span style="color:purple">https://draftable.com/compare/JHYFfXWaHGRx</span></a><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white">Here’s the diff for the IPR Policy (all changes
since version 1.2
shown:<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><a
href="https://clicktime.symantec.com/a/1/8q3XvGqohjM8pvFAj8n2TNaDAB0so_mrZcspY58oCLE=?d=zYU90j46QxTFNxAvlm_vJ4ZGqsTgwmt8yY9zvr0ptokxsxcxPTiHyfv81qHB08VOX3rrzZExOGgmgJkxIPZh2VDCB2-WrHv3HSXYZ8Wzk09rw2zFsyEvlFL13nhb7UzygerGhghF5qQl0uKJbkrgfHeL3_MxqGdnvlA7v_LK1cQLQhJS5vIh8quuXAU7PSSJvzKot7DAJo6bZDIRpzkFwNY2W9QBa2ODpEWTq9Pgug2qPyiezauI14B6fZZzXDwU0Ivj6KGS2Dy_1JXgXrsoUU_njc0WcH8N60MzLhzfYru_KK1QzFyolSRuA_TbFD0QG9P-7dp5mSt1H1BWsQ8OFAuLGgGHPbw9v12-oYSxeZkcV1l_eqlq15pTQI-hUSzH_gt5129IW5k-Txy56XOL79S-5w%3D%3D&u=https%3A%2F%2Fdraftable.com%2Fcompare%2FQuHvYZiCAAUr"
moz-do-not-send="true"><span style="color:purple">https://draftable.com/compare/QuHvYZiCAAUr</span></a><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white">=<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">Best
regards,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">Virginia
Fournier</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">Senior
Standards
Counsel</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><span style="font-size:10.5pt"></span><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"> Apple
Inc.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Segoe
UI
Symbol",sans-serif">☏</span><span
class="apple-converted-space"><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"> </span></span><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">669-227-9595</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Segoe
UI
Symbol",sans-serif">✉︎</span><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"> <a
href="mailto:vmf@apple.com" moz-do-not-send="true"><span
style="color:purple">vmf@apple.com</span></a></span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white"> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white">On
Dec 21, 2017, at 11:19
AM, Virginia Fournier
via Govreform <<a
href="mailto:govreform@cabforum.org"
moz-do-not-send="true"><span style="color:purple">govreform@cabforum.org</span></a>>
wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white">Hello
all,<span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white">Here are the final documents for Ballot 206.
Please confirm
that you’re ready
to go forward with
them in January
after the
holidays. Please
also let me know
if you can open
the Bylaws diff
file. What is the
status of the
Server Certificate
WG’s charter?
Thanks for
everyone’s hard
work on this
project.<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><CABF_Ballot206_20DEC17.docx><span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><CABF-IPR-Policy-v.1.3_20DEC17_clean.doc><span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><CABF-IPR-Policy-v.1.3_20DEC17_redline.doc><span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><CABF-Bylaws-v.1.8_20DEC17_clean.doc><span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><CABF-Governance
Change
FAQ_20DEC17.docx><span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><Bylaws
DiffNow Comparison
Report.htm><span
class="apple-converted-space"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">Best
regards,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">Virginia
Fournier</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">Senior
Standards
Counsel</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><span style="font-size:10.5pt"></span><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"> Apple
Inc.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Segoe
UI
Symbol",sans-serif">☏</span><span
class="apple-converted-space"><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"> </span></span><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">669-227-9595</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Segoe
UI
Symbol",sans-serif">✉︎</span><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"> <a
href="mailto:vmf@apple.com" moz-do-not-send="true"><span
style="color:purple">vmf@apple.com</span></a></span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white"> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white">_______________________________________________<br>
Govreform mailing list<br>
<a
href="mailto:Govreform@cabforum.org"
moz-do-not-send="true"><span style="color:purple">Govreform@cabforum.org</span></a><br>
<a
href="https://clicktime.symantec.com/a/1/8rSOldnBKg8XvPcCi-8xhn3L1EZQhM_E6Wxoe2uL3ps=?d=zYU90j46QxTFNxAvlm_vJ4ZGqsTgwmt8yY9zvr0ptokxsxcxPTiHyfv81qHB08VOX3rrzZExOGgmgJkxIPZh2VDCB2-WrHv3HSXYZ8Wzk09rw2zFsyEvlFL13nhb7UzygerGhghF5qQl0uKJbkrgfHeL3_MxqGdnvlA7v_LK1cQLQhJS5vIh8quuXAU7PSSJvzKot7DAJo6bZDIRpzkFwNY2W9QBa2ODpEWTq9Pgug2qPyiezauI14B6fZZzXDwU0Ivj6KGS2Dy_1JXgXrsoUU_njc0WcH8N60MzLhzfYru_KK1QzFyolSRuA_TbFD0QG9P-7dp5mSt1H1BWsQ8OFAuLGgGHPbw9v12-oYSxeZkcV1l_eqlq15pTQI-hUSzH_gt5129IW5k-Txy56XOL79S-5w%3D%3D&u=https%3A%2F%2Fcabforum.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fgovreform"
moz-do-not-send="true"><span style="color:purple">https://cabforum.org/mailman/listinfo/govreform</span></a><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"><br>
=<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<pre style="background:white">_______________________________________________<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre style="background:white">Govreform mailing list<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre style="background:white"><a href="mailto:Govreform@cabforum.org" moz-do-not-send="true"><span style="color:purple">Govreform@cabforum.org</span></a><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre style="background:white"><a href="https://clicktime.symantec.com/a/1/8rSOldnBKg8XvPcCi-8xhn3L1EZQhM_E6Wxoe2uL3ps=?d=zYU90j46QxTFNxAvlm_vJ4ZGqsTgwmt8yY9zvr0ptokxsxcxPTiHyfv81qHB08VOX3rrzZExOGgmgJkxIPZh2VDCB2-WrHv3HSXYZ8Wzk09rw2zFsyEvlFL13nhb7UzygerGhghF5qQl0uKJbkrgfHeL3_MxqGdnvlA7v_LK1cQLQhJS5vIh8quuXAU7PSSJvzKot7DAJo6bZDIRpzkFwNY2W9QBa2ODpEWTq9Pgug2qPyiezauI14B6fZZzXDwU0Ivj6KGS2Dy_1JXgXrsoUU_njc0WcH8N60MzLhzfYru_KK1QzFyolSRuA_TbFD0QG9P-7dp5mSt1H1BWsQ8OFAuLGgGHPbw9v12-oYSxeZkcV1l_eqlq15pTQI-hUSzH_gt5129IW5k-Txy56XOL79S-5w%3D%3D&u=https%3A%2F%2Fcabforum.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fgovreform" moz-do-not-send="true"><span style="color:purple">https://cabforum.org/mailman/listinfo/govreform</span></a><o:p></o:p></pre>
</blockquote>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="background:white"> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif">_______________________________________________<br>
Govreform mailing list<br>
<a href="mailto:Govreform@cabforum.org"
moz-do-not-send="true">Govreform@cabforum.org</a><br>
<a
href="https://clicktime.symantec.com/a/1/KWHUJyvbWQ0I0Js0zkSYKfeYYniJWZxjGSDaTOyAlm4=?d=z8uFZACvsDzTuJbEaCp7aXW6SCoYhz-bFvmW6SyYnto0W62uPsrU6ZnBevOd3aa6T4M9jyTYjdJwW4tAR5wtr1esYdlnX32XBMrnTfCpRk2D8ER3v_LBzbnQZfDfmLAibMEgDhmEvEk3mPcoUKkTd9-Bfoew8sg113ZYKtwri90WuU7fWnnNPbtiMBA7N7E8urhD7X5g79vzzPYcbiVtLOYJMGTOZS2jUh5dHgitx3cwDyutUMet4oaW3AOCZeRmBYYbEpZDivtRvTqrirZQzdT65rKkJ83z4hFMxw_MLninJFFRyRR5vbZWrgbtm5aMfxpDGat5N3GP9-ZgkFvA8O9h-pdUG38frjTL5UHuUuZcOizYLhGTdb48WDzXzY9q5oFVNO8%3D&u=https%3A%2F%2Fcabforum.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fgovreform"
moz-do-not-send="true">https://cabforum.org/mailman/listinfo/govreform</a></span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
</blockquote>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<br>
</body>
</html>